Featured Question and Weekly Words: The Cunning Fox

thrill of the chase(Again combining a Featured Question with Weekly Words from Forrest: April 15th, 2016)

(Forrest’s answers/words are in Red)

Mr. Fenn,

Being a newcomer to the chase and classifying myself in the ‘Little girl from India’ group, as I live in Cairo Egypt, I very much doubt in the near future at least to pay a visit to the Rockies. But just infront of my laptop has opened up so many avenues of seeing and learning about the region and its indigenous people. So, Mr. Fenn you got that right!

Knowing that the poem has been written in an obtuse way with all of us having great ideas about the solve, some of which are so intricate, sensible, logical and still wrong; It certainly makes for a great puzzle.

Obtuse means annoying so in continuing your thought I will toss that word right back to you in paraphrase. If all of you have such great ideas about the solve, how can they be wrong?

That said and sorry if it has been asked before but I have one question for you, Mr.Fenn – if I stand at the place where warm waters halt, I will also be standing there or inherently very close to the same spot when I have found the blaze? ~ Richard

P.S.) My thoughts behind this is that you, Mr.Fenn, lead us on a trip from the beginning to the end but both are actually in the same place. IE a return journey so to speak. I am just thinking of the verse by TS Elliot and of course you being as cunning as a fox!  My sister had a fox fur coat sir. f


Best of luck with the Thrill of the Chase and all that you seek. Enjoy Life’s Adventures.

Other Links of Interest:

Forrest Fenn and Hear Me All and Listen Good

The Still Mysterious Writings of Edgar Allan Poe

The Lost Treasures of the Atocha


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100 Responses

  1. Friend says:

    Had to write since I have never been first before.
    Now…… time to digest comments…. 🙂

  2. pdenver says:

    Thank you, Jenny, Richard and Mr. Fenn for this week’s Featured Question and Weekly Words. Going to think about this while arranging flowers. Interesting.

  3. astree says:

    faux … good one, Forrest !

    • JL says:

      FF wrote once if I remember correctly, Sometimes it wise for the fox to dress like the hound. I have used this tactic most od my life. The problem I found is sometimes it gets boring playing such a part, every once in awhile if you look quick out of the corner of your eye you catch a glimpse of the Fox.

    • astree says:

      Ha, Jake. Maybe a TX accent would work, guess it depends on how you pronounce it. 🙂


      jl, which eye is most common ? I’m curious about that.

      Some good codes in the fox statement, one of the skip codes gives latin “hoc saxo” (that’s skip 5 starting with H in “had” and 2nd S in “sister”. or, skip 6 starting with the T in “sister” for TAR.

      Don’t forget the taxes. :0 (although there is an extension this year until April 18)


      • JL says:

        Don’t forget the taxes. :0 (although there is an extension this year until April 18),the tax man cometh od that it would be extended until the 18th this year, fortunately, I have already met my obligations so that I may now focus on my fishing lessons. Its next year I will have to worry about.

        Most people are right-eyed dominant and right handed…..I am od for some reason not genetically known in my family, being left eyed dominate and mostly ambidextrous when it comes to my hands, preferring left handed I have always had to learn in reverse from right-handers. I hope that answered your ?

        • astree says:

          DEEDNI,, jl. Thanks for the reply 🙂

          • JL says:

            Albert Einstein some say was left-handed, others say right-handed after seeing pictures of him writing on a chalkboard. When I was called in class to write on the chalkboard I would use my right hand even though I was left-handed, was easier for some reason unknown to me. Perhaps Einstien was simply ambidextrous.

            Astree, you seem very creative. Are you perhaps left-handed or ambidextrous?
            Learning in reverse from a right-handed person might not be the correct description, as a left-hander it seems everyone is backward, in reality, I think it is more like a mirror image

          • astree says:

            jl, I replied to you further down, but another comment. I spent some time wondering why not all people are ambidextrous. It seems there, on average, must be some (marginal) advantage to having a handedness? Maybe we respond better in emergencies, where quick decisions are required (not taking that extra split decision to decide which had to use). Seems like we lose a lot, though, too.

            Here’s one you might like: Looking at the “mY sisteR haD A foX fuR coaT siR” (and noting no comma!), starting at the end and reading the last letters looks like

            TAX DRY (today is normally tax day in America)
            aRe TRAX DRY ?

        • r says:

          being left handed is a character trait of ”the lobo”, I myself am also both ambidextrous. 2 to the body and 1 to the head was the motto from past experiences, left handed came in handy!!!!!!!!

  4. Ramona says:

    I find this particular question and answer obtuse. Thanks Jenny and Forrest.

  5. Was that really a question?

  6. Mark J says:

    “Obtuse means annoying so in continuing your thought I will toss that word right back to you in paraphrase. If all of you have such great ideas about the solve, how can they be wrong?”

    That is funny…….and humbling.

  7. Kim says:

    Sitar music makes me happy. I’ll assume you take your coffee black? Love!

  8. Jake Faulker says:

    I guess that smokescreen doesn’t work on all.

  9. Strawshadow says:

    Thanks Jenny, Forrrest, Richard and Who, Many solves only one solution. I’m flipping a coin and guessing a vixen. If the only answer lies in a question then why begin with only three senses. Acutely obtrusive and densely provocative. Why does my mind keep bringing me back to Pretty Woman. And yes humbling.

  10. WiseOne says:

    Jenny, About the red text… Was that your choice or forrest’s?

    Forrest, Sadly, my sister also owned a fox coat… Kit fox. She said, “Like my new coat?” I told her the coat looked better on the fox.” She gave me a odd look and went about her business. Sometimes people are oblivious to the obvious… Or are they just being obtuse?

    It also sounds a little like f might be implying that women can be equally as cunning as men.
    BTW, nice fox photo. 🙂

  11. Kathryn says:

    Interesting letter. Someone in Egypt sounds like the Internet is the only source of knowing about the US – Rockies. Further inspection, the writer appears to have a command of English that English is the first language. Anyway a fox fur coat! I am trying to find a home for a mink coat – inherited. I care not to don animal fur which I agree probably looks better on the animal. Interesting thought about the poem and TS Elliot.

  12. The Wolf says:

    Thanks Jenny and Forrest/Richard. That is really acute little fox you have there. I took a really cool picture of one playing in the daffodils near Thunder Bay once.
    The Wolf

  13. Onuat says:

    Some vixen is hot on the trail. It’s in the red. 🙂
    Thanks Jenny and Forrest and Richard.

  14. Muset says:

    Hot! Axis used.. arms carry it off.

  15. So why is six afraid of seven?

    • astree says:

      Look at your time upstairs..

      • astree
        “Some good codes in the fox statement, one of the skip codes gives latin “hoc saxo” (that’s skip 5 starting with H in “had” and 2nd S in “sister”. or, skip 6 starting with the T in “sister” for TAR.”

        This code has me in a confused state, would “hoc saxo” in latin not mean “for this stone”

        • spallies says:

          hmmm… In Ethiopic script, red is used analogously to italics in Latin text…

          Lol… Forrest you have your very own color… Red 🙂

        • astree says:

          I just thought the “hoc saxo” looked interesting, since some have mentioned stone markers, or 3 “stone” (42 pounds). Maybe it means something else, or nothing :). The next letter after the TAR sequence is I, so TARI. Which looks a lot like “tarry” and reminds of last weeks “urgency…”

          Some have been discussing the red letters and the Fandango (fox) puzzle. The p. 51 image of “Fandango” has opposing red border letters that spell FUR and the FOX is directly between these letters.

          jl, interesting about how you automatically wrote with your right hand on the blackboard. It seems that our English script is made for right-handed persons, that cursive with the left would be awkward. I use both hands, I am better my right.

          • astree says:

            A photo taken at a grocery store on Mount Desert Island, about this time last year, while exploring the Fandango puzzle


          • Magic 8 says:

            When I shoot pool, I line up left or right handed depending upon the angle. Default to lefty. Throw with the left and bat right. Pretty muddled between the two in everything I do.

            Do you know how to determine the dominant eye? That’s one I haven’t figured out.

            • JL says:

              Magic 8,
              “Do you know how to determine the dominant eye? That’s one I haven’t figured out”
              My guess is you are left eye dominate, hold out your hand in front of your face and using your index finger sight at an object 20ft away. Now close your right eye and if your sight line is still the same then you are left eye dominant, if it changes then you are right eye dominate.
              I own a lot of the same traits and believe that I learned to use different hands depending on who was teaching me. Not always, though. I used to rope and tie calves, rope them right handed and tie them left handed. My dad tried for years to get me to tie right handed but eventually gave in and was amazed at how much more speed and dexterity I possessed with my left.

              • Magic 8 says:

                Thank you JL. You were correct, I am left eye dominant from the test you suggested. In the fire department, they taught us to tie knots right handed. Didn’t even realize it. Still tie my shoes lefty from my mom. She’s straight up left handed.

          • JL says:

            hoc saxo = 42 now that is interesting. I will file that away for future reference. I live on a rock pile and if I where to find 3 stones weighing 42 it would seem I should change my name to Oedipus.

        • IMO, the chase for Hyde Park is Pueblo Alto Trading Post http://mapcarta.com/23316242 , which is northeast of Castillo Lake http://mapcarta.com/23267128 and southwest of Tanner Lake http://mapcarta.com/23333184 .

    • twingem says:

      Let me show you the work of the humble. Listen. ~ T.S. Eliot

  16. JohnR says:

    So the what ifs aren’t about a secret map in a drawing in ttotc. Hmm. What could those what ifs be?

  17. Not sure what to make of it all, as I’m still relatively a newb and the techno speak is wizzin right over my head. But fortunately I realize, just like a car, I don’t need to understand how or why everything works ‘under the hood’. I’ll let the mechanics and brain-iacs worry about all that gizmo stuff. As for me, I just need enough knowledge on how to use the key and make it gooooo.


  18. Magic 8 says:

    Shame on you Richard for insulting Forrest Fenn by telling him his poem “written in an obtuse way.” It is an acutely written work of art IMHO.

    As for f’s responses, perhaps he is hinting someone’s solution was not wrong. With thousands of potential solutions, maybe someone got it right. The comment about his sister being the sly fox, that person may be a female. Let’s hope the person who was “not wrong” is a little girl in India. For now, the Chase continues!

  19. Reap says:


    FF answered this question once during an interview at a book store. (Youtube: Forrest Fenn, Moby Dickens Book Shop, 11/02/2013, and skip to 7:48) There is no switching back or making a loop. The whole Q&A is great. He even mentions his bones rotting in the sun, suggesting the crest might not be in a cave.

    Also, it is kind of funny; FF maybe saying, “even the cunning fox can get turned into a coat.” Perhaps translating into, “Even this extremely clever poem will be solved someday.”

  20. Mefromthere says:

    Are we the ones being played with?

  21. Woody Bogg says:

    I am a bit color blind ! Does that mean I see it in a different light?

  22. William says:

    Jenny did you pick the color of the font red or was that Forrest?

  23. the Wolf says:

    This story was so intriguing it almost put me into cardiac arrest. ddxx

  24. Seannm says:


    What surprises me a little is that nobody to my uncertain knowlege has made the connection with the red type to the book.


  25. Jacob says:

    This is just another comment telling us that even if we don’t find it, isn’t it still worth it? I would say time relaxing with friends and family is worth it, but not when the finish line was your goal. Getting people out into nature is a good objective, but if it has been found or isn’t out there…. I hope someone admits to it before we see another Randy situation. It is disheartening that even though I have emailed F a couple times he does not respond, but replies to random questions with vague answers. I have decided to go and search my spot at the end of this week, I don’t want to allow “Urgency to Fallow”. If I am right, every clue has a double meaning that directs you where to go. And the poem sends a message, But who knows… We shall see if it is good enough weather for hiking back there.

  26. cowboy says:


  27. Michelle says:

    So…I believe I know of the area of which Forest talks about; just not the exact placement of the chest. Went there last weekend searching but no luck finding the chest. The place I’m looking in completely match the poem and his other hints.

  28. Ramona says:

    Hmm, still thinking. Red and Fox, aha Redd Foxx! Did you know he was an artist?

    “Foxx was not only “The King of Comedy,” but also a talented artist. He took a sketch book with him whenever possible, and enjoyed creating his own fantastic images or capturing the essence of those whom he loved or admired.” http://www.reddfoxx.com

    No you say? Ok I’ll keep looking.

  29. WiseOne says:

    I’ve read the red Weekly Words/Q&A here and I, too, am feeling pretty good about my interpretations.
    Anxiously awaiting another one. 🙂

  30. 23kachinas says:

    I seem to remember Red Fox’s bday is December 9th…so he’s a 9 of clubs in Metasymbology (cards symbols)


  31. 46/2 says:

    This post seemed to stir up something in ff, wonder if the vixen was wisely wearing a new coat?
    TS Elliott may stirred emotions with
    “You are the music while the music last”
    IMHO of course

  32. twingem says:

    Hi 46/2, I’m not following your line of thought. Could you elaborate?

    • 46/2 says:

      This person doesn’t seem to be a newcomer.. But Maybe so.
      However, this person said to ff “So, Mr Fenn you got that right”.
      It’s Fenn’s party, can any of us tell him what he got right?
      Also this person Called his poem “Obtuse ” and “makes for a great puzzle”,
      as if it were a crossword in the Wednesday paper.
      Sounds like a hound that was once dressed as a fox … IDK just my humble opinion.
      Would like to know what Richard’s comments would be to ff’s reply.

  33. 1) “you being as cunning as a fox!” -“My sister had a fox fur coat sir. f”

    Translation: You can portray the fox image and fool them.

    (““It doesn’t matter who you are it only matters who they think you are” -f)

    2) “If all of you have such great ideas about the solve, how can they be wrong?-f”

    Translation: Everyone’s imagination is the key.

    (“consider the what IFS”)


  34. Always interesting, lots of good comments here

  35. Drum says:

    What IF

    When considering the what ifs, consider this possibility with the thought of the lost treasure of paititi in mind. What if the first half of the poem is solid, meaning larg fixed immovable clues and the last part is a delicate maze that a person could mess up. The first searcher there could essentially remove any possibility of another searcher figuring out the blaze. (Assuming the blaze is multiple objects in trail form) What if that is what has happened….like a runaway train without a conductor.

  36. Austin says:

    FF comment lends more credibility to the idea that the treasure is a hoax. “How can they be wrong?” Really! Well how about that the idea is supposedly about the actual location of a real object! This isn’t supposed to be some liberal win-game-fest that has no wrong answer. If the various ideas about the poem don’t solve it then YES, they’d be wrong.

    • Goldwatch says:

      Austin, I believe what FF is saying is that if their ideas aren’t so great if, in fact, they are wrong.

    • Just heavy loads and water high, IMO is Castillo Lake http://mapcarta.com/23267128
      If you’ve been wise and found the blaze, IMO the blaze is a Pinon Tree standing alone with limited vegetation near it
      Your effort will be worth the cold IMO, the chest is in Castillo Lake http://mapcarta.com/23267128

      • Buckeye Bob says:

        Well, not to be a negative guy, but will that tree standing alone still be there in years to come.
        I’ve read your start, and that’s not bad at all. But in my mind a person needs to have the whole thing figured out up to the “blaze” to have any confidence in the solve. (Because the blaze may not be visible or obvious outside of being there.)

        If you think you’ve got it, though, and if you have the time and can afford any outlay of money needed, how can you go wrong to go and check it out?

        I wish you luck and fortune. Treasure or not. 🙂

  37. Farley says:

    I would say xxxxxx but I’m a nice guy and I’ll leave it at xxxxxx EDIT.

  38. sunbuddy says:

    Letters in bold Red
    red…..rouge……rainbow,,,rogue,,,maybe a job for astree. I think I will ride off in the sunset like Cisco Kid.
    besides if you aint the lead dog the scenery never changes, this fox has been skint, about time to move on. Its been real, its, been fun but it aint been real fun. Just got to settle up a few things then catch up on all those things I lost out on in my youth.

  39. geezleweez says:


    Your name implies you would have to put forth incredible effort for line twenty two.

    Myself; the nights are still cold, and delay would bring hot days, and neither are very fun! I do enjoy the hike, my first time was incredible, and every trip thereafter brought such a beautiful feeling that I am dying to go! However, my current life situation(s) have brought a bit of indecision. Perhaps that is the key to my flexibility?

    In addition, the what and why have led me down a different path. I still am deciding if…


    …just keeps playing over and over again in my head…between phrases of the poem, of course!

    Urgency… …fallow… …does sumbuddy have an ACE up their sleeve?

    Have a sunny day!

    • sunbuddy says:

      If you go I don’t think there is enuff room in the car for all of yous.
      If you stay would be dependent on where you’re at?
      Are you nigh at being a stick in the mud?
      There are no cards up my sleeve ,I play straight up and look life right in the eye. You just wait for the right hand, it looks out for the left.

      It is a wonderful place, a person could spend a lifetime there and never discover all the secrets, elk and grouse today. I got to watch the flight path of a jet. There is a very curios rumbling, that I have noticed every trip. It woud be very special if I found a hot springs for me and my girl and gyrl to take a hike to. How did I look, am I impresive or hopefully just average? I wonder how many trips it would take to dig up every tarry spot?
      I was hoping you had planned a float for us with Randy B. I guess I have one more day to dig holes with primitive tools, a humbling experience before God, and brings back childhood memories. If I stay any longer then that I will suffer the wrath of the matriarch.

      Should I stay or should I go. That fox didnt get skint but its getting close, sumtimes you just gotta wait from sunup to sun down.
      sunbuddy, what are you?

    • Brolin says:

      If you must then oct probably best month to search in.

  40. Jazz says:

    I walked out on my balcony looked up at the stars then went to bed there is a golden serenity in knowing what you know. Sometimes life is a piece of honey comb, if you know where the hive is ZZZzzzz

  41. PL289 says:

    I keep coming back to this WW. Interesting comment given before the actual question was even asked. Must’ve been having a rough day.

    • sunbuddy says:

      “; It certainly makes for a great puzzle.”
      Maybe a ruff day, they didn’t say. It’s the ending that I found interesting.

      • PL289 says:

        I guess it depends on who or what is doing the actual ending of something. Two trips. Why are so many worried about rough days when all the bad stuff seems to happen at night or early morning.

  42. jack says:

    And 10.2 is 85 % of 12, whats your point?

  43. deb says:

    Colorado is a Spanish adjective that means “red”.

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